My favorite subject.

Word of the year, courtesy of my favorite forum- "Ineptocracy* (in-ep-toc'-ra-cy) - a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. "

Come on Hopatcong put those contracts on line so we taxpayers can see how much it's going to cost us to break those contracts if we decide to fire some one who is not producing. The one I'd like to see is the Superintendent's contract because he's making $170,000/year for sub par schools.

Teachers have sick pay because they don't get disability! They have to have something* if they get really sick or in a car accident. And the days accumulate as they are not used. A new teacher only has a few days to use, so basically, he/she is in big trouble if they get in a car accident because they dont have enough days accumulated yet.

Before you post something Patch, get both sides of the story. Now you're giving out biased information, just like Christie.

I think Christie is going to keep taking away from teachers until we have absolutely nothing left! Give us a break already!

You don't deserve and generally do not get "breaks" in life Marge. Generally, you work for what you earn. I'm sorry but I do not consider "not being sick" work and therefore one should not be paid for "not being sick". Especially with the great teacher health plans that cost so little to help keep a teacher from becoming sick.

Great idea. While we're at it let's outlaw yearly bonuses in the private sector in the Health Sector (costs us more) Finance Sector (costs us more) pharmaceuticals (costs us more) an upper tier management (reduced dividends). Private or public, in the end it's the consumer who pays for it.

No wonder NJ and NY are in such a mess. People (public) work here to earn their pensions and leave here to generally retire some where else. Why? Because after they retire they don't want to pay the property taxes the rest of us are left to pay.

Part of the "me, myself and I", generation unlike the generation before us called "the greatest generation", who fought in WWII and lived through the longest recovery period after the Great Depression. What ever happened to "shared sacrifice"?

Here are the 10 worst states for retirement, with No. 1 being the lowest ranked, according to TopRetirements.com:

Worst States for Retirement....Why You Should Think Twice

1) Illinois - Poor fiscal health
2) California - Expensive, and its finances are in disarray
3) New York - Very high taxes, including property taxes
4) Rhode Island - Worst-off state in the Northeast from a financial viewpoint; high taxes
5) New Jersey - Highest property taxes in the United States; has pension funding issues
6) Ohio - High unemployment and cold winters
7) Wisconsin - High property taxes and frigid weather
8) Massachusetts - High cost of living and high property taxes
9) Connecticut Taxes Social Security and has high property taxes
10) Nevada - Foreclosure capital of the world

Private sector companies stopped this process looooong ago. The unused sick and vacation time is a huge drain in the bottom line. And since the taxpayers have no way of offsetting these liabilities they should be stopped. Capping the unused time is a reasonable solution and can be negotiated at the next CB go around.

end pensions too

I say we let the teachers keep their salaries, sick leaves, vacations, sabbaticals, perks, healthcare plans, and whatnot. Just empower the supers to fire them all at will.

The information given on the amount teachers can collect is totally FALSE. There is a State cap on unused sick pay of $18,000, regardles of how many sick days one has "banked" . I don't know where Patch found a payout of $45,000 for a Parsippany teacher. On another note, if Christie and his crew keep denegrading the teaching profession, and removing the benefits, you will soon lose all of the experienced teachers, and will no longer attract bright young people into the job.

You don't know what you are talking about concerning teachers. The amount of payout that a teacher such as the one in Parsippany(30= years with a Master's) could collect is $18,000. NOT $45,000. I don't know where Patch found that amount, ; it simply is NOT correct. NO teacher has ever collected that amount for unused sick time. You are correct when it concerns the newer teachers; $15,000 is the amount, soon to become much lower.
Try doing the job, then you are qualified to speak about it. Apologies for the typos, they belong to me!

So basically what taxpayers would like is for public employees to work for minimum wage with no health insurance, no pension, and no paid sick time. What's next? No raises? No over-time pay? I know for a fact that a town not too far from here basically "punishes" employees for using sick time. When it is time for their yearly review if they have used more than one or two of their alloted sick days their yearly bonus (yes, I know, only those in the private sector are entitled to merit bonuses) is reduced. That says to me they are encouraged to accumulate sick time. I keep hearing "private sector". We all pay for private sector benefits and perks too, just not in the form of taxes. You think you don't pay for a Walmart executive's 6 weeks of vacation per year? You sure do, it is worked into the price of the goods you buy. You think you don't pay for a Cablevision executive's premium health insurance package? Ponder that the next time your cable bill increases. All of you anti-public employee folks act like public employees don't pay the same taxes as you do. You also seem to think public employees aren't entitled to the same standard of living as those in the private sector because your taxes pay their salaries. That is just ridiculous. There is plenty of wasted tax dollars to look at before you start attacking your fellow tax paying citizens salaries and benefit packages.

Maybe when the state pays back what it robbed from the pension systems they can have a say. Just like poker, ante up or don't play! Most public workers only get 50 cents on the dollar for accumulated sick days upon retirement. Bargained and contracted. The overtime figure which would be paid out if workers used sick time and substitutions were made somehow never gets listed in theses one sided articles!

Thank God Christie has safety cities for illegals, this way he can staff the schools and municipalities. No one wanted to work for municipalities because of the low pay. I look at wonder at the bonus and raises the private sectors gives to the employees for their performance. The public sector does not have that nor would I suggest they do, but not every public servant belongs to a union, but are being punished by the state and the residents. Always remember that these servants live in the state, pay all their taxes as well as everyone else, but they unfortunately were willing to take a job at low pay for the benefits (that they pay for).Public employees pay taxes, pay into their pension and very few have disablitity insurance because the towns they work for decided not to provide insurance that the employee could pay into. It is the mismanagement of the pension system by State Governors, who have taken billions from the pension fund that has put this subject under the miroscope. The fund was over funded in the 90's till Whitman decided to take $2.5 Billion out of the fund to balance the budget (as did her predessors), invested the fund into Enron to make up for the lack of state contributions and, there has been no contribution by the State into the fund for the last 10 years which has been a burden on the local municipal fund to pay the state retirees. No this is not the fault of the public servant, this is the fault of the politician! Give the public worker a break!

Morris Township, fortunately, does not have much of a problem with this because years ago, we negotiated limits on these payouts. This was before the unions began electing people to our Township Committee, so let's hope these limits will last.
Rick Watson, former Mayor, Morris Twp.

Anyone who wants to check teacher sick pay payouts can go to the TPAF website and read the law. The State has a cap, and that is it. For those who are hostile about teacher benefits, I have the following advice. Get certified, get an advanced degree, and become a teacher. It is a wonderful job, that is until recently when the media, and the politicians have made teachers scapegoats for every problem in society.
And, by the way, for those who think that most teachers make three digit salaries, check the statistics. It is a very small number. Most people stay in the job for five years, and leave. The idea that is promoted by the governor and his crew that most experienced teachers are inefficient is untrue; would you want an inexperienced doctor to operate on you? As for private schools being better, know this. Anyone who fails, has poor attendance, fights, uses drugs, becomes pregnant, curses a teacher out, or assaults a teacher, guess where they go when expelled from private school? Public School. Because the Public Schools must accept everyone.

Still paid for by the taxpayer. Unless we go to only educating kids who have parents who can pay for it, and the rest remain illiterate, that is the way it has to be.

Summer comments:

Well, all I know is, the young "inexperienced" teachers we've had (especially those not yet tenured) have been excellent - AGREE

The older, soon-to-retire teachers have been anywhere between verbally abusive, to awful with young children, to good-with-kids-but-poor-communicators-and-minimalists (e.g., arranging the day so they are sure not to have any work to do outside of school hours) - AGREE not all but many.

I don't know the solutions but I do know that the tenure system and unions drive this "do the minimum" behavior and changes the motivations of younger, enthusiastic teachers, to fit the mold of the public employee - AGREE

I'd love to see teachers going the extra mile, but it's rare When I have, it's typically been an untenured teacher not yet seasoned by the pressures of the union and administration, or the lack of incentives to do an exceptional job - AGREE

The superior system would reward excellent teachers with good pay but not necessarily a "job for life" (I've seen the stats -- I think it's 0.1% of tenured teachers in NJ are let go each year, and only when there are lawsuits)- or pension, neither of which are realistic in this day and age - AGREE

Here's my suggestion...run for the school board in your town. Because it's people like you who can SLOWLY change the system.

My two oldest children were school teachers before "retiring" and raising a family. They had same complaints. It should be based on PERFORMANCE not TENURE.

BTW...here's the link for the school system salaries. I am not trying to get on the teachers but I'd say "educators" as a whole are well paid starting at $275,000.

http://php.app.com/edstaff/results2.php?county=%25&district=%25&school=%25&lname=&fname=&job1=%25&tfm_order=DESC&tfm_orderby=SALARY

Pension funds aren't too bad either...

http://php.app.com/NJpublicemployees11/results.php?lastn=&firstn=&location=%25&countyname=%25&fundname=Teachers+Pension+and+Annuity+Fund&tfm_order=DESC&tfm_orderby=locsal

If you want to see what an agency, town or pensioner makes go to this site.

http://www.app.com/datauniverse/

Teachers salaries are public record (at least in WT). I did see a list of all the teacher salaries, and most tenured teachers were over $100k, with the new teachers starting at $40k. I tend to agree with the statements that layoffs or firings should be based on performance levels, not tenure. I have personally witnessed several tenured teachers treating children badly, yelling at them, etc. (my child being one of them). This is an outrage. The principal says work it out with the teacher. No one is saying they don't work hard, however, the reality of it is that some things just aren't necessary (like huge payouts). As in my other postings, I blame this on Unions. I have worked all my life in non-union jobs and there are no "laws" that you have to be given breaks, lunch, sick pay, vacation, or insurance. I have no pension for retirement after working close to 40 years of my life, busting my butt, and still have to work (if I ever find a job) another 20 to get social security (if there is any of that left).

Here's the site for the municipalities that are ABOVE the 2% property tax cap

http://php.app.com/proptaxes11/results.php?COUNTY=%25&MUNICIPALITY=%25&cap=Above&Submit2=Search

and BELOW the 2% property tax cap

http://php.app.com/proptaxes11/results.php?COUNTY=%25&MUNICIPALITY=%25&cap=Below&Submit2=Search

Their salaries are no different than someone who has worked for the same employer for the same amount of years!

Don't stand down wind then

As for the comment to go to college, get a degree, and become a teacher, I wish I could have. I came from a dirt poor, large family, and started working as a waitress when I was 15. After graduating from high school, I worked every day of my life in a non-union job, until the birth of my child (20+ years later--at which time I was married and could afford one). I could not afford college, yet people who are not even legal citizens in this country can get an education. As stated above, there were jobs I had to work where I got minimum wage (most of the time), worked over 40 hours, did the job of many, didn't get sick time, vacation, or insurance, yet I killed myself to become an asset to society, rather than another lazy, statistic on the taxpayers payroll. I get no pension, and cannot collect social security for another 20+ years (if I can find a job before that time, and since you have to be employed in the 10 years prior to collecting), and if there is any money left (which I payed quite heftly into but am presently not entitled to). No it's not just teachers, it is everywhere including the welfare system (which was intended to help people during times of crises like we are experiencing now), not generations of child bearing lazy people, illegal aliens who get better treatment than US citizens paying into the system, etc.

And there are also people who work just as hard. When I started out of high school, the job I held was as a Receptionist, which meant answer the phone and greet people. Through the years it became Secretary, which was answer the phone, greet people, file, type, make coffee, take notes, etc. It then became Administrative Assistant: phone, greet, file, type, take notes, make coffee, mail, purchasing, scheduling, payroll, accounting (payables, receivables, bank reconciliation, checkbooks, taxes), and so on with a never ending list of jobs required for little pay. I have run entire companies with what I have done, other than physically going out and getting the business, but everything within. If that is not working hard, then I don't know what is. I have helped teachers out all I can with regards to my volunteering, gifts at Christmas, end of year, etc., as well as donating class supplies and don't have anything near what they get.

We've clarified a point in the column. The payouts for Parsippany teachers hired prior to 1993 are different than those for teachers hired after that year.

One last post on this. "Summers Off" is not paid time. Most teachers must find employment for the summer. You are incorrect about most tenured teachers make $100,000. Tenure has nothing to do with pay. By the way, it only political protection, not lifetime employment. Any experienced teacher who does not do the job, is rude to kids, etc. needs to be fired. If the tenure law needs to be tweeked to make this easier, most teachers are for it. The benefits teachers have were put in place to entice people to go into the job. Remove them, and most people will go into a more lucrative career. Once again, if you want to do the job, get the credentials, and do it. Most of the people who go into teaching from the private sector do not last, but you might. There are positions in the urban areas, such as Newark, where if you have the strenghth, and something to offer the kids, you might be able to make a difference. There is nothing more rewarding than a kid coming back to thank a teacher for their help or guidance. That is priceless......

Why is this such a big deal to you people? It doesn't affect you either way. Most of u are just upset because its something u don't get. It doesn't affect u or your taxes so stop crying about nonsense

@Doglover: Teachers are paid an "annual" salary, they are not paid by the hour. Therefore, they are paid during the summer they are off. As a non-union person, I only get paid for the time I work, not a flat salary for the year broken out into weekly or monthly payments. Also, in my town, those are the salaries the "tenured" teachers are earning. And as for firing those who should be, not too long ago during this huge teacher layoff situation in both NJ & NY, the last in, were the first out, period. That is how it is right now.

All of the people bitter and angry in this column will remain that way, and all those with a cavalier happy attitude will remain that way. The fact is nothing gets solved on an internet forum...EVER. In fact it has been proven most internet forum-based heated discussions will inevitably descend to someone calling the other side Nazis or Hitler. Wait for it...wait for it...

Its a public forum. We do still have freedom of speech right? Or are the public employees abusing that too?

This has nothing to do with what I don't have. It is what they continue to "want," "get," and insist they are entitled to with my "taxpaying" dollars. Private companies that pay people like me minimum wage or barely above, aren't getting it from the towns taxpayers, it is coming from those who buy their product, which has nothing to do with money directly funded with my tax dollars. I'm told if I don't like it, get another job there are plenty out there waiting for one. They have a "union" saying they can't be treated that way, and this is what they are entitled to, with money "I" pay for.

James I'm sure you voted for Corzine who now has run a company into the ground and its missing 400 million dollars......and he didn't do anything for New Jersey except line the Unions pockets including his girlfriends...so your mad because you are losing something....stop crying and join the rest of us...many who have no jobs! here's a tissue...

Ummmmmm..........public employees pay taxes too. Private companies also give bonuses, which I don't get. Alot of private companies are closed the day after thanksgiving and I have to work........Its not fair! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.......

Don't get mad...get even. I appeal my taxes every year no matter what the cost. Last year I got $2,500 knocked off. This year I'll get another $1,000. Here's the site.

http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxation/pdf/other_forms/lpt/petappl.pdf

It's the best thing you can do to increase the value of your home. Then sell it and get out while there's still time. When the state or towns run out of money and there's no one left to tax, it will be the public employees taxing themselves for their pensions, benefits and salaries. That will be like the best thing that could happen. Even if they reassess, you'll be that far ahead of the next guy. If you need a tax attorney and appraiser let me know.

Im not losing anything .. I have a job and im not going to waste my time crying about what other people have. What has christie done that personally affected you?

Yea that makes sense

Bronson thanks for the tissue. Id say thanks for my pension but the governor doesn't make that payment. He just tells u he doea

Does

Here we are, middle class people fighting amongst ourselves and critisizing the few remaining who still have a decent benefits package. Meanwhile, the rich get richer and have a good laugh at our stupidity.

I actually agree with something Max said! It is at our expense they have what they have. Many of us who used to be considered Middle Class, are no more, so as you stated yourself in so many words, they are the ones who continue to get richer, while the rest of us keep getting poorer.

nothin for nothin!!! every cops a criminial and all sinners are saints. mick jagger!!!!!

We can no longer afford to pay for decent benefits because our wages have been stagnant for years.

"As private-sector unions have withered, public-sector unions have grown dramatically. The Bureau of Labor Statistics reports that, in 2009, for the first time ever, more public-sector employees (7.9 million) than private-sector employees (7.4 million) belonged to unions. Today, unionized workers are more likely to be teachers, librarians, trash collectors, policemen, or firefighters than they are to be carpenters, electricians, plumbers, auto workers, or coal miners".

http://www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/detail/the-trouble-with-public-sector-unions

"New Jersey has drawn national attention as a case study, but the same scenario is playing out in state capitals from coast to coast. New York, Michigan, California, Washington, and many other states also find themselves heavily indebted, with public-sector unions at the root of their problems. In exchange, taxpayers in these states are rewarded with larger and more expensive, yet less effective, government, and with elected officials who are afraid to cross the politically powerful unions".

"But if states' and cities' fiscal ills grow painful enough, the unthinkable could someday become political necessity. If such a rapid recovery is not forthcoming, though, the most appealing solution will be for everyone to re-enter the real world — if only public officials and public-sector unions can be sensible enough to try".

The economy is not improving or recovering. Brother can you spare a dime?

continued...

Courts across the nation also generally held that collective bargaining by government workers should be forbidden on the legal grounds of sovereign immunity and unconstitutional delegation of government powers. In 1943, a New York Supreme Court judge held:

To tolerate or recognize any combination of civil service employees of the government as a labor organization or union is not only incompatible with the spirit of democracy, but inconsistent with every principle upon which our government is founded. Nothing is more dangerous to public welfare than to admit that hired servants of the State can dictate to the government the hours, the wages and conditions under which they will carry on essential services vital to the welfare, safety, and security of the citizen. To admit as true that government employees have power to halt or check the functions of government unless their demands are satisfied, is to transfer to them all legislative, executive and judicial power. Nothing would be more ridiculous.

The very nature of many public services — such as policing the streets and putting out fires — gives government a monopoly or near monopoly; striking public employees could therefore hold the public hostage. As long-time New York Times labor reporter A. H. Raskin wrote in 1968: "The community cannot tolerate the notion that it is defenseless at the hands of organized workers to whom it has entrusted responsibility for essential services."

@Doglover: Not to "beat a dead horse" as the saying goes, but no matter how you look at it, if you are paid the salary of $100,000 a year, it doesn't matter how many days, hours, etc. you work. You get the same amount no matter what for the ENTIRE year. How you get paid weekly, monthly, etc., and how you budget that FLAT SALARY during the whole 12 months, is totally different than if I am paid "BY THE HOUR," If I work 8 hours at $10/hr., I get paid for 8 hours, period. Not $10x40 hrs. weekx52 weeks=$20,800. If I am out sick, etc. and only work 24 hours during the week, then I don't get a salary of $20,800, I get less. This is a HUGE difference in what you are saying that teachers have to get jobs in the summer to support themselves. I think not.

My friend in the " private" sector makes over $100,000 and is getting a big christmas bonus. Its not fair!!! Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!

The scenario that's playing out in Greece, Spain, Italy implementing "austerity" programs to combat their sovereign debt. A brief history. .

http://exiledonline.com/all-pain-no-gain-a-brief-history-of-austerity-program-massacres-disasters/

Conclusion: All pain and no gain

It's starting to occur in Great Britain now as well. All are victims of what people in Britain call “the cuts” — the government’s defunding of civil-society institutions in order to balance the nation’s books. In London, austerity means that there will be about 19 percent less to spend next year on government programs".

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/11/opinion/when-budget-cuts-lead-to-broken-windows.html

A glimpse into the future for the USA....

http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/austerity-riots-a-glimpse-of-americas-future

"There are some important differences between the situation in Greece and the situation in the U.S., but there are also some important similarities. Budget cuts and other austerity measures are being promoted by the political leaders of both countries. Greek citizens have reacted very negatively to austerity plans. As budget cuts on the federal, state and local levels in the United States start to really become painful, we will eventually see the same kind of austerity riots in this country'.

Prepare...

http://www.politicalgateway.com/news/read/173353

Why???

http://www.timeline2012.net/prepare/social-economic-impacts/economic-depression

Plus I don't know of too many hourly employees that get any kind of bonus at all. It seems that all the managment get that for saving the company money, and how is that done? By cutting the wages of those hourly people, making them pay huge fees for insurance (if they get it), and cutting jobs by giving the work to those who are already overworked.

Conclusion...

There are only three possibilities to recover from the current financial apocalypse. One is to raise taxes, however, it is not likely taxes could be raised fast enough to avoid bankruptcy or slow enough to avoid destroying the economic growth and the value of the U.S. dollar against world currencies.

Second is to have more money coming into the system than is being spent by the system. This implies reducing expenses on every level from individual to government, but also maintaining continuous economic growth. The only way to stimulate this possibility is sound fiscal management and borrowing more money, however, this only takes us further down the road of unsustainability.

Third is by divine intervention. What you say? This means forgiveness of all debt by the Federal Reserve Bank and bond holders, printing even more money, and giving it to every ailing corporation or Government, interest free? Not a plausible solution as it results in exponential inflation and an immediate collapse of the U.S. economy.

No matter how this plays out, it is a certain fact that the U.S. currency will be devalued to the point of extinction. In other words, a single U.S. dollar today may be worth only five cents tomorrow. The collapse of the U.S. dollar will go hand-in-hand with the collapse of the economy. The Amero is the currency they have planned to replace the Peso, Canadian and U.S. dollars just as they did with the Euro.

Folks, please do your best to keep the conversation civil (even when replying to someone you feel isn't). We're glad to have a space where people can debate points they feel passionately about. But there's no need to get insulting, mean-spirited or profane. We'll delete comments that are any of those, and we'll suspend the accounts of repeat offenders.

If you feel a comment is inappropriate -- don't respond in kind. No one's going to be swayed by being insulted. Instead, hit the small link that says "flag this inappropriate," and we'll take a look.

@James: I guess my post was removed for calling you a name. But what it said was apparantly your "friend" (probably yourself) is the one sitting behind a big expensive desk, not doing much of anything, while the rest of us hourly workers do the work for you. And my guess is you haven't seen any of the Undercover Boss tv shows, as none of them could do the job they were paying the rest of us miniscule salaries to do.

When I first started working in the public sector I was surprised that we do not have the short term disability that I thought was a law when working in the private sector. It was explained that the sick time accumulation was to compensate for the lack of that insurance. No question though that it is being abused. Solution: Sick time does not kick in until an employee is off for two days without pay. (If I am sick, I’ll take the hit.) Then, sick time can kick in with a doctor’s certification. We need a doctor’s note to return to work after three days off anyhow. You will see a big drop in one and two day call-out if we don’t get paid for them. As for the retirees hitting the jackpot: If we are covered by short term insurance we would not collect “un-used” time when we leave, why collect sick time when we leave? Don’t blame the unions for all of this. They only get as much for their members as they can. That’s what they are getting paid for. Nor does the fault lie with the people on the other side of the table who were too afraid to stand up to the unions. They were being paid to keep the schools open and the police on the road, and they thought this should be done at any cost. But; let’s not look for fault, look for solutions.

Honey if I was making over 100,000 I wouldn't be involved in this conversation. And calling names just shows your character. If you're not happy in your current situation stop blaming others and change it yourself!

A whole thread of whiners, totally amazing. The only person responsible for anything is the person in the mirror. Christie this, Obama that, since when was anyone in government responsible for your life? You don't like your situation? Change it, or sit there making excuses about how others are stopping you from reaching your potential. Public employees have benefits that are off the scales, private employees work harder than the imagined rich people.

I am growing tired of over educated over privileged underachieving people crying all the time. Go spend some time on the streets of Newark or Camden so you can realize what you have.

Can't wait for the next Depression to hit....these comments will all be a thing of the past.

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/17-quotes-about-the-coming-global-financial-collapse-that-will-make-your-hair-stand-up

"More "waves" will come after this next financial crisis. If we continue on the road that we are on, our economy will progressively get worse and worse".

"Not everyone will agree with this analysis, and that is okay. In the end, time will reveal the truth to all of us".

"Right now, we all need to get ready for the next wave that is about to hit us. A lot of people are going to lose their jobs over the next few years. Hopefully you are prepared for that".

Guns, ammo, bottled water, canned food, dry food, fuel are good starters.

Its raining today . Must be the public employees fault.......waaaaaaaaaa

What does montville have to do with hopatcong? If you people have all the answers to being a better teacher then step up and do it! Leave your desk and run a classroom for a while. I don't see any teachers telling you how to do your job......

Private Sector workers are the Bob Cratchets of the work force. Except he was a much nicer person. They have allow their Corporate employers to rob their incomes and benefits and instead of fighting back, they have caved to higher stock prices, dividens and upper management incomes. Maybe they believe they will make it to the top one percent but the odds are against them. The proof is right in their faces in the growing income disparity. Their answer is instead of fighting for their rights and a fair benefit package they want to tear down others who have fought for those things. Every dollar taken from another middle income public employee is a dollar taken out of the little demand we have for products and services. With a reasonable multifier effect it is a blow to regaining our ecconomy. Don't be jealous of those that have joined unions, join one yourselves. You are a part of the 99 percent and you will always be a part.

Waaaaaaaaaa.........

and public employees can certainly purchase disability insurance on their own. my husband does and WE pay for it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BduQxAugn4c&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEW5ZJt1xto&feature=related

Both sides of story so you decide why we're in the mess we're in today. .

@Doglover: Don't even go there with the Obama crap about "spreading the wealth around." That is for the people who made this whole mess, those lazy people being supported by MY hardworking tax dollars. It's the reason I can't sell the home I put $100,000 in cash down on! The Obama nonsense about everyone being entitled to the "American Dream" of owning a home. BULL! If you can never in your lifetime afford to pay for it, you are not entitled to it. Because I was unable to go to college, doesn't make me a piece of dirt! And just because, I am assuming you have a degree, that doesn't make you any smarter than me. That's just plain nastiness.

@Doglover: In regards to your statement that none of us "hourly" whiners would do your job, just what job is that? With that nastiness, you certainly couldn't be one of the teachers we are discussing (oh wait, yes you could, one of the ones that needs to be removed, but can't because of the UNION).

"Men who have gone to college I find to be amazingly ignorant. They don't seem to know anything." Thomas Edison - NY Times 1921

Looky loo, what am I giving up? Please tell the governor to make my pension payment!

@Roll Back our Tax: You are correct when you state things are going to be getting worse. However, the people who will continue to be affected are only the "hourly whiners" who are too lazy to go out and get a better education.

@Dan Grant: Oh, let me join the Union for Accounting, Secretaries, Cashiers, Wait Staff, Cooks, Clerks, Payroll, etc. Oh wait, I don't seem to see anything for those jobs. But God forbid there were none of us willing to do these jobs, because then there would be no companies in business without us. You all act like you're so high & mighty, but if we all went on strike, whatever your job is, it wouldn't get done.

You're right. But this idiot is now obligated

Max get your facts straight. Whitman made the bad investments and started the mess

Yea okay ! Like I said it started way before him. And they're all criminals ......

Again, tell me what's over. I have a job and what is crusty cleaning up? How has he personally helped Looky loo?

This whole thing has gotten way of the track it was originally about, which is paid, accumulated, sick time upon retirement, not how much teachers make, what they are paid, or anything else. And since I am a single parent, Doglover, you can certainly come to my home every evening to watch my child (without pay) while I go to school to get a "better" education. In the real world I Iive in, people who have a piece of paper aren't necessarily smarter than I am (this is a FACT from experience). You can put me up against anyone with an Accounting degree, and I guarantee you I know AS MUCH, IF NOT MORE, than they do (something I have been told on many occassions when applying for jobs--yet only the ones with that piece of paper get). So this means I should be treated like dirt? I don't think so. During my ex's experience taking college classes in the "computer" industry, sorry to say, but he got fed up with it as he had MORE knowledge than the teacher who he had to correct on many, many, occassions. And I've seen how all those people with degrees and education could do the jobs that the rest of us are paid very little to do. One of the most shocking, the CEO of Great Wolf Resorts couldn't even function as a waitress! All those big wigs were either "fired" by, or wouldn't be hired by, those of us "under educated" people to do our jobs. And from what I've seen, a majority of people with those high earning degrees never pay their loans back!

Im not the one crying. I have plenty of sick days to use. I have no intention of getting paid for my sick time. That's there for me to use. And you have yet to tell me what the governor has done that personally affected you. It seems the only ones having fits are the ones like you who are Pissed that people get things that you don't.

James, it seems you and Doglover just don't get it. This has nothing to do with people wanting what someone else has. What is wrong with you people? It has to do with getting paid for accumulations of days people aren't sick. I am happy for them that they are lucky enough not to get sick. If this is such a big issue, than maybe they should start taking days off and use it up. It just seems to me that it is taken advantage of.

How would you get more money in your check? Once again, look at all the people in the governors office getting paid and collecting a pension. That's a much bigger problem than sick time!

Eventually we will be paying more for the retired personel and have less of the actual working personell ... the system can't be sustained at this rate....we will have to cut hiring new people to work, in order to pay for the retired ones =less cops,fire fighters,teachers...

Thanks max! I guess ill be using a sick day friday

And speaking of lies, why are u all praising a governor who got elected on a lie?

Do you see what is going on here? When you watch the news and see people shooting their co-workers, bosses, or just plain anybody, you may want to think about this.

That's really stupid!

Yea and what about lord christie?

Not as stupid as you might think.

Hahahaha

He'll be a distant memory in 2020 and he is still obligated to make the pension payments he keeps neglecting. His grudge with unions isn't going to lower your taxes or help you in any way at all. And ill be collecting my pension that u think u pay for

Good luck with that

Mikey you hit the nail.While we fight the politicians get their perks and laugh at us.

If Christie wants to clean house why not start on top were the real money is. Thanks to the paper bring to light the PVSC scandal with all the relatives and friends cashing in on tax payers money. I'm sure that was common knowledge among the politicians. They don't like to step on each others toes.
Christie talks about putting a cap on superintendent pay. Great! But it should also apply to Charter schools. Why let someone get paid more and at the same time only has a couple of hundred kids under them? That is also tax money going out the window. Is that going to be the next scam that we are going to have to deal with. Who is starting these Charter Schools? I think I read somewhere that the VP brother is lobbing for them in FL? I was reading a charter school application filed by "Florida House speaker designate Will Weatherford and Anne Corcoran, the wife of future speaker-select Rep." was rejected. They both voted for Senate bill 736. I just know when money comes into play everyone will line up to cash in. They promise you everything you want to hear. In the end we are the losers. People in power will use their connections and be first in line.
Right now the people have the power. You can vote and also get on the school board if you don't like the way they are running it. The problem is most people don't even brother to vote for school elections. Once you give up your schools it's gone for good.

When I began my muncipal career in Butler back in 1975, there was a clause in the labor agreement between the borough and the association (local union) setting up dollar amounts of compensation for percentages of unused sick time which were capped at $8,000 and $10,000 but not tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands. This was part of the bargaining process over the years that we accepted on condition of not receiving higher percentage raises. Many like myself retired getting only a small portion of the accumulated sick time in this manner not having to use 100, 200 and 300 sick days accumulated over the years.

ok, let's be real.. most private sector jobs don't give disability anymore - so goodbye to that (we have to PAY for it)
next - most private sector jobs are 80 hours a week WITH work done on vacation - so a second job is even an option
next - most people in the private sector have HORRID pension plans - easiest way to cut someone's pay is to 'change' their pension plan / and increase out of pocket benefits cost.
..
the economy sucks... NJ is falling apart ... EVERYONE needs to take a hit.
--
and if ANYONE even mentions the whole 'teachers pay for stuff out of pocket' i'll scream.. i used to teach preschool and now i homeschool NEITHER qualifies me for a tax credit yet teachers get it.. trust me my homeschool out of pocket is WAY MORE then any teacher is laying out!

oh, and as for private sector... WHAT SICK DAYS?